From $40K New Business to $120K in One Year

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Most producers go years without winning a single Broker of Record letter. Chad Ginther had one BOR in his entire career, then wrote 14 of them in a single year while lifting new business revenue from about $40K to roughly $120K. He walks through the career goal setting that made call reluctance feel like a math problem, the pain-finding process that made BOR wins repeatable, and the belief shift that now has him hunting $30K to $70K revenue accounts. If bigger accounts still feel out of reach, this is what changes when the future gets personal enough to force different behavior.

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[00:00:00] Your new business, the best new business year you'd ever had before was around what? Yeah, probably 40,000 in revenue, I would imagine. Yeah, somewhere in [00:00:10] that range. And then last year, how much did you do? Probably 115, 120,000 in revenue. Um- Yeah, so I'm not great at math, but that would be 300% more. [00:00:20] Yeah, I think that's probably about right.

That's pretty amazing. And I think that there's something really unique about that, Randy. Uh, of those accounts, I think I wrote 16 [00:00:30] total accounts. 14 of those I won by BOR. And prior to last year, I only had BOR one account in my career.

Welcome to the Agency Growth [00:00:40] Machine Podcast, where it's all about transforming potential into profit. And now your host, Randy Schwantz

I'm [00:00:50] here with Chad Ginther. He's from La Porte, Indiana, couple hours outside of Indianapolis. He's got a really interesting sort of backstory and that's what we want to get into today from, as a producer and [00:01:00] ultimately a wedge guy and a Bignition guy and so let's get started. Say hi, brother. Yeah. Thanks for having me on.

I appreciate it. Yeah, it's been a long time coming here. [00:01:10] Yeah. So give us a little history. How, how long you been in the insurance business? How'd you get into it? Just give us some of that stuff. Yeah. Gosh, I think I'm going into my seventh year now. I was [00:01:20] started out with a captive Indiana Farm Bureau, a local company here.

A lot of good things there, but I wanted to do more, so got into the independent world. Actually talked a, a [00:01:30] local agency into letting me franchise from them. I had about a year and a half insurance experience at that time. I hired some staff, I bought a building. I worked my ass [00:01:40] off for two and a half years.

You went all in. Went all in, and that was it. We went all in. My wife was scared. So two and a half years in, my book was at probably 2 million in premium. [00:01:50] I had just enough revenue to pay myself and my health, and I knew to get to the next level I was gonna have to hire somebody else. But I still never really had any coaching.

And I [00:02:00] met Ben Zimmer from now Ethos Superior Insurance Partners, and over a year or so's time we talk and he's like, "Dude, what are you doing? Why don't we do this together? I've [00:02:10] got all these great people. I've got this, these silos set up. Everybody's good at what they do." He was a big culture guy. He knew how important that was.

And I'm like, [00:02:20] "Man, I really don't wanna go work for someone." I've been self-employed in the past. Yeah. I'm like, but if I'm gonna work with anybody, it seems like this is the right situation. Through, through his own coaching and [00:02:30] leadership, obviously his superiors brought you in. That's been an absolute game changer for me.

And I know we'll get into that more, but I think the, the biggest thing is it's, it's taught me a lot of [00:02:40] intentionality, really told, taught me how to value my time better. Obviously the goal-setting process we go through with you, it just completely changes my whole outlook on the industry and really what [00:02:50] I'm capable of doing.

Well then talk about that a little bit. How did that goal-setting... 'Cause, you know, every- everybody believes they do goal setting, doing locally. Every- everybody does goal setting. So what [00:03:00] was the difference between the goal setting you'd done in the past and what you've seen with others versus what happened when you got into Bignition?

How did that change things? I've made some Excel spreadsheets in the [00:03:10] past. I've used the Monarch app, and I've used some different things like that for just daily budgeting things, short-term goal planning. But I guess when I actually put it in Bignition and I looked at it and I thought, w- [00:03:20] we talk, I've got a 10-year-old daughter.

As much as I want another kid, I'm kind of glad I don't have them now. But when they start budgeting all that, like holy shit. I've got a person next door to me here that's got a [00:03:30] few kids, and they got three cars right now. We talk about that, three cars, three colleges, three weddings, all of that stuff that comes.

A- and I think that's when I started looking at that and really what I [00:03:40] wanted to do in my life. I didn't have the opportunity to travel much growing up. That was a big thing for my wife and I was how do we travel more? How do we go see places? Stuff that we've [00:03:50] never done, or maybe give our daughter experiences that we never had.

And that's really... I guess that's my why, too. And I think that's where part of this goal setting was like, [00:04:00] okay, what's gonna push my ass to get out of bed and make these tough calls when I wake up and I've got fear of making new business calls? W- you and I have talked about that. [00:04:10] And we've talked about this.

Probably the thing that hits me the most, you put a thing on the screen one day, and it was this guy in the military, and he had this sat phone up to his head. And it was [00:04:20] like, this guy is making a call, his platoon's behind him, and 100 feet this way is the bad guys, and he's telling them where to drop the bombs on the bad [00:04:30] guys.

Like, how tough of a call is that to make? I'm sitting in my basement looking at my phone thinking, "Jeez, Chad, just pick up the damn phone. Tell them [00:04:40] what your intentions are." And, and I think that's stuff like that So- We can talk about the... Go ahead Yeah, so are you saying that then the goal setting... [00:04:50] 'Cause, 'cause for those of you who don't know, we, the, the goal- we do career goal setting.

We're, as Chad mentioned, we're putting out cars, universities, weddings. We're funding retirement. Reverse engineer that back to now how [00:05:00] much money you need to save. Now you know how much money you need to save. But most people need to be saving between 65 and $85,000 a year, and most people are saving probably [00:05:10] 15, 18, 20 max if you and your spouse are both funding 401.

So most people are way under funding their future. Did that get under your skin a little bit? Yeah, drove me [00:05:20] crazy. It scared the hell out of me. I'm 41. I've kinda always thought I've got time. A- a- and you look at how these numbers too can compound. E- either you're [00:05:30] behind in interest or you're saving and that money's compounding.

There's two things that are gonna happen. Yeah. It's like I've gotta get away from this interest and I've gotta start compounding my investments. Yeah. Yeah. So then [00:05:40] thinking about that then changed, along with y- call reluctance, and so I just did a YouTube video about even call reluctance. Most people who have dealt with it are no [00:05:50] different than you and I.

A lot of us have call reluctance, but it just, after a while, it becomes a math problem. When I know that I gotta make 200 dials a month, and out of 200 dials, 180 [00:06:00] times, 150 times I'm not even gonna talk to anybody. And then when I do talk to somebody, there's a percent of those people are gonna blow me off, and then a percent of people are gonna set appointments.

It's just [00:06:10] math. And for me to get the math I want, set the appointments so I can have the sales calls, it's, why am I taking it personal? Just make the dials. It's just part of what you have to do. But when you don't have [00:06:20] that clarity and you don't know what to say, then all of a sudden that becomes a bigger boogeyman gonna get you.

Yeah? Yeah. Yeah, it's all about having a process. And I think [00:06:30] that's what this is all about. It's not just about the wedge process. It, it's from everything you talk about from the Red Hat introductions. There's a hell of a lot more to this that, than I ever imagined. I, I've still got a lot [00:06:40] to learn with you, but right when I think I got it, there's more.

And, and I think that's where this process has taught me to lead a conversation better [00:06:50] versus being led, and that's been truly unique. All right. So then let's talk about, before we get into any more of the, the how and the what in that regard, let's talk about the results you got. Your [00:07:00] new business- The best new business year you'd ever had before was around what?

Yeah, probably 40,000 in revenue, I would imagine. Yeah, somewhere in that [00:07:10] range. And then last year, how much did you do? Probably 115, 120,000 in revenue. Yeah. So I'm not great at math, but that would be 300% more. Yeah, I [00:07:20] think that's probably about right. That's pretty amazing. I think that there's something really unique about that, Randy.

Out of those accounts, I think I wrote 16 total [00:07:30] accounts. 14 of those I won by BOR. And prior to last year, I only BOR one account in my career. So what was the mind shift that [00:07:40] made that happen? I had a process. We had a process to be able to determine what the pain is. Obviously, through the Wedge training process, we know, okay, what's in our arsenal [00:07:50] now?

What are we able to do that's maybe different than our competition that we can bring to the table and say, without saying anything bad. I think that's my favorite part of the process. You don't have to [00:08:00] bash the other agent. We're just making these assumptions that it's already being done. And I think going through that process for me, it's really been helpful.

So are you at all [00:08:10] surprised once you started using the Wedge, the response you got from prospects? Yes. It's not even the response, it's the [00:08:20] time that it saves me. I spent so much damn time quoting and praying. The first five and a half years I was in insurance, I would get upset because I [00:08:30] thought they liked me, and it would hurt my feelings.

And the more I lost and I think about all this stuff, I kind of think, "Was I not interesting enough? Was I not this? [00:08:40] Was I not... Like, what did they need to hear? What's important to them?" And it really helped me, like, sit on the other side of the table. Yeah. So it's interesting. There would be a lot of [00:08:50] people that would just say to a, a producer like you, "It's all about relationship."

And that just echoes in people's ears. It's like going through the Grand Canyon. Woo, [00:09:00] relationship, relationship, woo. But the reality is relationship's a huge factor, but there's two sides to that coin. You gotta build it, but you also gotta be able to bust the incumbent [00:09:10] relationship. If not, what happens?

And we've seen it thousands and thousands of times. You bring back a better deal with better coverage. Somehow the incumbent finds out about it, matches it, ends up [00:09:20] keeping the business. You get rolled, and then you feel bad about you. And that's the pattern most people live under, isn't it? Yeah. And it costs you a lot of time and a lot of money.[00:09:30] 

Yeah, and it costs you a lot of feelings. We wanna talk about feelings. There's nothing worse than that guilt feeling of, I must be stupid. Why- I see other people figure it out. Why [00:09:40] can't I figure it out? Did you ever have to go through, did you go through any of that emotional crap? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. All of the self-limiting beliefs.

Maybe this isn't for me. This guy's just better than me. [00:09:50] He can speak better. He can do this. You make all of these excuses. And I think what starts to happen is you start doing things a different way all the time. You don't have any consistency because you're [00:10:00] always trying to fix stuff because it's always broken, and you never truly have a regular process that you feel comfortable talking about.

Yeah. So back to last year. You wrote 16 [00:10:10] accounts, 14 by BOR, had had one BOR before in the first six years of your career or something like that. The best you've ever done before was 40,000 new business. Last year you did 120, [00:10:20] 300% better. So now when you look into the future with that as a foundation, how do you see the future differently?

I, I'm definitely going to go upstream more. [00:10:30] And I used to think these big shots, they're all over it. There's no way I can bust into that because they're with one of the top three in the country, and I'm seeking that now. 'Cause those guys get [00:10:40] lazy. They get complacent. So, so just to restate what you said, you, you're gonna guess the top three in the country.

You thought they were big and badass, and what you're finding out is that beating those [00:10:50] guys is not that much different than beating anybody else, that they don't have anything special. They don't have Superman suits, and even though they got a big name behind them, they're pretty mediocre, pretty [00:11:00] average.

And so when you can raise your game just a little bit, you feel confident, and you've also proven you can go win that business. Is that what you said? Yeah. [00:11:10] I'm gonna assume, particularly coming from Indiana Farm Mutual, I think is where you said you started out. You, you got used to writing a whole bunch of little itsy, bitsy, teeny, weeny crappy [00:11:20] accounts.

Is that kind of true? Yeah. Yeah. And so now this, this belief that you can go after accounts with 10, 20, 30, 40,000 revenue. [00:11:30] Is that, uh, is that the shift you've made in terms of belief system? Yeah. Last Monday I met with one that's probably 70K in revenue. And I think that's it. And we don't spend time [00:11:40] on stuff unless we have commitments now.

And I think that's probably the most unique thing is we, we've got some commitments there last week. We put dates to stuff. And before [00:11:50] I get immersed in this, we're gonna make sure that they hold up their side of it too. And it's, it's to the point now to where we talked about walkaway power. As we do, as I continue to get more and more [00:12:00] opportunities, when we continue to help more and more great clients, they want to refer us.

And it's created more and more walkaway power for me. And I, I f- I can feel it myself in meetings, and I think they [00:12:10] can feel it. It's almost like they want to work with you more because I don't have to work with them. I know I have something truly unique, and whether it's helpful to them or not, that's okay.

[00:12:20] And, and that feels good. Yeah. Yeah. So as everybody's listening to the story, when you put the timeline on it, you think about it in perspective, went from [00:12:30] Indianapolis, Indiana, Farm Mutual, writing little stuff, started his own deal, took on a bunch of the overhead. It was still, it was really hard to make money that way because, [00:12:40] 'cause you can't hardly write enough small accounts to be able to justify the overhead to grow, to make money and have profit and all that kind of stuff.

Finally got an independent agency business. Started thinking about it [00:12:50] differently. But was still getting rolled. And then changed the sales process, changed how he goes about it. Has more concrete black and white differentiation. Can go into a sales call and [00:13:00] actually believe he can win. And because he believes he can win and he has a process, he is winning.

14 accounts last year by BOR. Now he's prospecting [00:13:10] 30, 40, 50, $70,000 revenue accounts. You sit there and you start to project that out, and you go, "I wonder how long it's gonna be before this guy's a million dollar producer." Whereas before it's like you were almost ready to quit, [00:13:20] weren't you? Yeah. That's a big shift, brother

big shift. It's a big shift to my household. Yeah? And to your wife. That, what does it mean to her? It's definitely helped [00:13:30] taking the stress load off. Randy, I think it was three years ago, my W- my personal W-2 was $31,000. Like I said, I've owned businesses in the past. I sold a business when I was in my late [00:13:40] 20s.

I've had some success. A- and to bring home that kind of money, and my wife's a social worker. Oof. Bless her heart, but at the same time, I'm supposed to be making up for that, and she's [00:13:50] carrying the load on top of every- all the other mom duties, and it... Holy crap. I felt this big. Yeah. And, and that's when I knew something had to change.

I, I was, I've been in [00:14:00] all these different sales things, and when you came around, I was like, "Oh, God, here we go. Another one." A- and I think everybody's got their gimmicks. [00:14:10] Everybody's got their things. Hey, try this, say this, do... But no one has given us a true process to follow from start to finish, and not just part of the sale, but after the sale.

How do [00:14:20] we stay in front of them, do what we said we would do, and then remind them about that and quantify that to them? And that's, from start to finish, we haven't had that. [00:14:30] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Now, I'ma, I'ma flip the subject on you here a little bit. There, there are people that have gone through the training, and, and you know them, that have said they [00:14:40] hate Randy I freaking hated you my first couple months Freaking hated you

at Talan. That guy's crazy. He's all... Like, I, I was so intimidated. And I was even a [00:14:50] little intimidated before this call today, honestly. But I think that's where I haven't been pushed so much in this industry to get uncomfortable, to get past [00:15:00] something. A- and that's what I needed. And honestly, I told Ben this, it wouldn't have been as good coming from him being my direct superior.

They [00:15:10] needed to do this through a third party, because it's better to be pissed off at a third party than your employer. And is it fair to say that a lot of us need to get pissed off? We need to be- we... [00:15:20] It's like Dawson, who we were just talking about, who's had, he's in his first year and is already at 90,000-plus in new business.

He'll, he'll, the, who kn- who knows what he's gonna do. But he's one of those [00:15:30] guys. On, on one of our calls, he went through the wedge. And so part of my challenge to everybody, you, if you're a golfer, would you show up on the [00:15:40] course with the golf bag and no clubs? Of course not, 'cause you're a golfer, and golfers know you got room for 14 clubs.

But how many salespeople show up with, [00:15:50] with zero named black and white, quote-unquote, "service wedges"? There's a bunch. And so I'm always challenging guys like you and guys like [00:16:00] Dawson. I called out Dawson one time. I said, "How many wedges do you have memorized?" He goes, "One and a half." And then I kinda lit into him, and then I asked him for a commitment.

"45 days. Are [00:16:10] you big enough boy to where you can memorize 15?" He goes, "Yes, sir." "Will you do it then?" "Yes, sir." And he did. And so that's part of the thing that [00:16:20] too many of us, I feel, get babied. And the leaders baby producers a lot of times 'cause they're afraid that we're gonna run you off. But basically- [00:16:30] And, and maybe there's some truth to that.

Let's just assume, okay, there's some truth to that. But the flip side of it, how much talent are we wasting because we never challenged somebody to step up and close [00:16:40] the gap of what they're capable of doing? I think it's a bunch, don't you? Yeah. And, and honestly, they're playing a lot of different roles in the agency, these guys.

And, and I think that's where [00:16:50] guys like Ben, he was a great producer. He's got good leadership skills. But you know too, you've... We- we've gotta have a great trainer. And, and I think that's where someone devoted to making everyone better every [00:17:00] day in creating consistency. As people come and go, you got different programs in.

And, and the more consistency that I have, the more successful I'll be. We all need to [00:17:10] be called out on stuff like this. And so when you sit there and you get a simple system you can manage, rather than trying to be in a whole bunch of different places, life gets better. And I [00:17:20] think that accountability's important.

That's something, I don't even know if we've used that word yet. And I think when I think about the Monday Masterminds, and I think about even the newer producers coming in here to Superior, [00:17:30] we have all these tools now w- through you to people who wanna be held accountable can be held accountable. Um, and I think I need accountability.

I need these account [00:17:40] managers. I need Ben, I need Drew, I need everybody. And I need to take something from everybody. And I think that's where the best advice I'd give a producer, find a good mentor. Yeah. And I think that's, [00:17:50] you've probably heard that a million times in your career. Yeah. It's, and as a former athlete, my kids were all athletes, played college ball.

I, I don't think it's necessary that you hate your [00:18:00] coach, but there's gotta be times you hate your coach. There's gotta be times. 'Cause that's them. They, you can encourage people, but sometimes you gotta get in their grill too. [00:18:10] And that's just a huge opportunity for a bunch of leaders. A- and you don't, again, you don't have to be mean, but man, getting a lot more direct and leading people to make decisions about what they want their future to be [00:18:20] like.

All right. Mr. Chad, we, we just wanna say congratulations to you again. To increase your new business by 300%, it's pretty amazing. To go from only [00:18:30] having gotten one BOR in your career to getting 14 in the same year, really amazing. To, we didn't ask what your average account size is, but we know it's going up a lot.

[00:18:40] It's amazing. So keep up the good work. Appreciate that. I appreciate the work that you and your team put in. Contin- And, and really it's new content, the new [00:18:50] ideas. I know you get new ideas from people all over the country. And I think that's where, it's easy to fall off, think, "Oh, I got it." And then like I said, you, you run into a guy like Dawson, it's like, [00:19:00] "Holy crap, I fell off."

Yeah. "This kid's good." Yeah. And I think that's what re-engaged me to say, "Hey, I gotta get my ass back out there and get back to work." It's- Yep ... I got a lot more work to [00:19:10] do. Obviously I'm not doing this alone. You know that. All right, buddy. Keep up the good work, man. We appreciate it. We appreciate you. Thanks, Randy.

[00:19:20]